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On Tue, 11 Apr 1995, Robert D. Seidman wrote:

> On Mon, 10 Apr 1995, R Ballard wrote:
> 
> 
> > If Microsoft gets over 2 million subscribers to MSN, the price will jump 
> > to about $400/year.  More importantly, they can track piracy through 
> > "snitch clients" built into Microsoft applications.  The SPA collected an 
> > extra 14 million from about 5000 corporations (no I'm not sure of these 
> > numbers, it's in a PR NewsWire article).  With "SnitchWare" Microsoft can 
> > sue everybody.
> 
> You lost me...the price for WHAT will jump to $400/yr.?  For the client?
> The one that will be bundled with Win '95?  I don't think so.  Not in the
> consumer market.

Bottom line costs to be a part of MSN will be around $400/year, probably 
in the form of Subscription fees, paid directly to Microsoft.

> > The point is that MSN is structured exclusively around Microsoft 
> > Exchange.  I can get a Dial-Up to an NT Server running Exchange, or I can 
> > get NT/Exchange on a local/corporate server.
> For mail, yes.  But the server is on MSN.  All the end user needs is the
> client, which is also bundled in Win '95.  I'm not sure we're talking 
> about the same thing?  
The primary purpose of MSN is to try to knock UNIX, the main staple for 
internet servers, out of the market in favor of Windows NT.  I can get 
Unix (or equivilents) from 100 vendors at prices ranging from $20 for a 
CD that converts a Windows 3.1 compatible PC into an internet server, up 
to the $3 million ES/9000 with AIX.  The free-market compitition in the 
UNIX arena has led to sevaral gigabytes worth of applications available 
as "Unsupported Software" (with quarterly updates) about 1500 
applications contributed by sources ranging from Sun Microsystems, IBM, 
Hewlett Packard, and DEC, to local colleges.

Linux will probably be the #2 operating system for PCs by the end of the 
year.  Unless Microsoft can get Windows-95 out in general availability 
(as "unsupported" if necessary) for under $60/copy, Linux will probably 
be the #1 operating system by the end of 1996.

Right now, I can get most Unix applications for Linux.  I can also get 
WordPerfect, Lotus 1-2-3, Dbase IV, Netscape, and even SMB client 
capability (so that I can mount Lan Manager hosts as NFS file-systems).
What I can't get is Microsoft Word, Excel, and PowerPoint.  But then
there's always SoftWindows (lets UNIX machines run windows 3.1 as a child 
process).

> > > but their actually might be some cost advantages to going the server route
> > > vs. using MSN.  Then again, there are probably cheaper methods to handle
> > > internal e-mail and Internet gateways. :-)
> > Yes, you can fake out the server into giving you multiuser mode for more 
> > users than you really have.  If you get caught, the legal fees will put 
> > you out of business.  The criminal penalties will make your life quite 
> > unpleasant.  Remember, the "SnitchWare" is built-in.
> 
> Now I know we're not talking about the same thing.  I wasn't suggesting
> ripping off MSN.  I was suggesting that there were cheaper ways for
> Internet mail access than MSN/Exchange for companies who wan't a gateway 
> for Internet mail.  There are lots of alternatives.  I think you're 
Yes, for $50, I can turn an old PC/386 into a multiuser TCP/IP server.
Those PCs that no one wants because they are to slow to run Win32s 
applications.  If I want an enterprize server, I can put up a Pentium 
with 3 1gig drives and 16 meg of memory.

> referring to the Exchange server separately from MSN.  I know MS has made 
> big pitches about Exchange (code name Touchdown or whatever).  In the 
> original post, I was speaking exclusively about MSN.  Sorry for not 
We were talking about the same thing.  The infrastructure for MSN is 
Exchange, running exclusively under Microsoft Windows-NT.  The 
infrastructure for the Internet is GPL source code, which can be ported 
to Unix, VMS, OS/2, or even Windows-NT, and is frequently sold in binary 
form with pretty Graphical User Interfaces to manage the configuration files.

> making that clear.  Having an Exchange server is not requirement for 
> using MSN.
Let me see now, you mean to tell me that I can use all of the features of 
MSN without even routing traffic through a Windows-NT box?  Tell me ALL 
about the alternatives.

Economics 101 - What is the price/demand elasticity of a Monopoly?

> Robert

	Rex


From rballard@cnj.digex.net Wed Apr 12 17:30:23 1995
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